Lou Dobbs on H-1B - Nov 13, 2007

From the Lou Dobbs Tonight transcripts, aired November 13, 2007.

DOBBS: New study show American colleges are producing more than enough graduates in Science and Math in this country to fill the needs of U.S. business, but corporate America continues to claim there simply aren't enough Americans trained in those fields and they must hire foreign workers, workers that of course end up being paid quite a bit less than American workers.

Bill Tucker has our report.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BILL TUCKER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): There is no shortage of students studying for careers in Math and Science. There is a shortage of jobs. That's the simply bottom line finding of a new study from the Urban Institute.

The study shows that between 1985 and 2000 435,000 U.S. citizens and permanent residents a year graduated with Bachelors, Masters, and Doctoral degrees in Science and Engineering. That's three times the number of jobs in Science and Engineering added per year, 150,000 during that time.

Separately Michael Teitelbaum at the Alfred P. Sloan Foundation told Congress last week that neither he nor a separate study by the RAND Corporation can find any evidence of worker shortages. These studies are not anomalies.

VIVEK WADHWA, HARVARD UNIVERSITY: Bottom line is that all of our research at Duke and now at Harvard shows the same thing. That there is no shortage of engineers; there's no shortage of scientists. Companies aren't going abroad because of skills. They're going abroad because it's cheaper.

TUCKER: As a result, Wadhwa says that more than half of the engineering graduate students at Duke don't pursue engineering as a career and there is another indicator that the market is anything but short of scientists and engineers.

PAUL ALMEIDA, DEPT. FOR PROF. EMPLOYEES, AFL-CIO: We should be trying to figure out how to incentivize (ph) students to advance in these Math and Science areas. It's clearly that there is no shortage. If there is a shortage, the supply and demand wages would be going up in these areas.

TUCKER: Wages in the science and engineering fields over the last five years when adjusted for inflation have been basically flat.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TUCKER: Now Lou, that's the Urban Institute, the Alfred P. Sloan (ph) Foundation, Duke, Harvard, the RAND Corporation. Studies done independently of each other, different researches, different funding, all reaching the same basic conclusion that there is no worker shortage. Lou, the problem is not a lack of workers. The problem these studies all conclude is a lack of companies hiring them. And as we've reported many, many times on this program those companies either off-shore the work or as you mentioned at the top, demand more H-1B visas and then pay those workers less -- Lou.

DOBBS: We've been reporting on this issue, the exporting of American jobs, the outsourcing of American jobs, middle class jobs, for four years. And point of fact, the idea that all of these highly regarded, highly respected institutions have found the same thing that we have reported her for four years. Congress just last week, the subcommittee on technology and innovation, suggesting that 30 to 40 percent of American jobs now are at risk of being outsourced, in addition to the H-1B problem.

TUCKER: Right.

DOBBS: Let's put this in some context. Let's just deal with that H-1B program, which all of these companies want to bring those foreign workers in under. What's the number of Indian companies that are using H-1B visas, seeking H-1B visas for the purpose of outsourcing those jobs right here in the United States?

TUCKER: Well five of the top six users of the H-1B visa program, Lou, as you well know, are Indian companies.

DOBBS: Yes I did, but I wanted because I'm in Seattle, Washington, tonight Bill Tucker, and I thank you very much -- I want to repeat that just for the purpose, the benefit, the illumination, the education, the enlightenment of one of the -- this city's most famous citizens, Microsoft Chairman Bill Gates. Bill Gates is among those calling for more H-1B visas. In fact, Bill Gates wants an unlimited number of H-1B visas. And we really think it's important that he be brought up-to-date on this issue. Gates testified before a Senate committee in March -- by the way, he was the only witness and there was only one fellow chariot -- that was Senator Ted Kennedy -- and Gates said the United States should allow, as he put it, an infinite number of foreign workers. We can't get above infinite no matter what we do.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BILL GATES, MICROSOFT CHAIRMAN: We have to welcome the great minds in this world, not shut them out of our country. Unfortunately, our immigration policies are driving away the world's best and brightest precisely when we need them the most.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DOBBS: Bill Gates, you just heard the RAND Corporation, the Urban Institute, Harvard University, come on and look at the facts. Most of those H-1B visas are being used by Indian companies seeking to outsource jobs at a very, very reduced wage. In fact, most of the H-1B computer professionals in this country are brought in at the lowest skill levels; about half of the H-1B visa computer professionals recently admitted to the United States, in fact during the (INAUDIBLE) entry level salaries, so much for the advanced, best minds. These are entry level jobs, not the highly skilled jobs seeking those H-1B visas.

So Mr. Gates, I certainly hope that you and I can have a discussion on that. I'm sure that you would be delighted to do that, but I'm going to ask for something less than an infinite number of H- 1B visas and when we compromise, as a matter of fact, I want to return to two years ago levels.